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Story - News

Jun 17, 2019 1:01 PMPublication: The Southampton Press

State Approves Law To Allow Driver's Licenses For Undocumented Immigrants

Jun 18, 2019 3:03 PM

Legislation was signed into law on Monday by Governor Andrew M. Cuomo that gives undocumented immigrants the right to obtain New York State driver’s licenses.

New York will join 12 other states, as well as Puerto Rico and the District of Columbia, in allowing undocumented immigrants the opportunity to obtain driver’s licenses.

The State Senate approved the bill on Monday—less than a week after the State Assembly had done the same. The Senate approved the legislation 33-29, with all 22 Republicans and seven Democrats voting against it.

State Senator Kenneth P. LaValle, who represents the East End, voted against the measure and later criticized its passage.

Assemblyman Fred W. Thiele Jr., who represents the South Fork, was a co-sponsor of the bill.

The law will go into effect 180 days from the bill’s approval, meaning the first licenses will be available in mid-December.

The governor signed the bill shortly after the Senate vote—but not before seeking legal advice from Barbara Underwood, the solicitor general of New York.

In a letter, written on behalf of Mr. Cuomo, the counsel to the governor, Alphonso David, raised concerns that the legislation could allow third parties and the federal government to obtain personal information to be used for immigration purposes. He pointed to other states that have passed similar legislation, in which the federal government has accessed State Department of Motor Vehicles data to target undocumented immigrants.

“The goal of many stakeholders involved in this effort is to enact legislation that helps undocumented individuals, not one that hurts them,” Mr. David wrote.

In response, Attorney General Letitia James declined to offer an opinion about any potential actions that could be taken by the federal government. However, she stressed that the legislation was “well drafted” and provided “ample protections” for undocumented individuals.

Minerva Perez, executive director of Organización Latino-Americana of Eastern Long Island, explained recently that the bill was amended to require U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement or U.S. Customs and Border Protection to obtain a judicial warrant before obtaining any state DMV data related to driver’s licenses.

According to Mr. Thiele, a major goal of the legislation, known as the Green Light Bill, is to improve road safety. In a press release, he pointed to a 2016 report from the Roger Williams University School of Law, which found the number of traffic fatalities to decrease in states with similar legislation.

“Keeping New Yorkers safe always comes first,” Mr. Thiele said in the press release last week. “We can’t get sidetracked by fear, rumors or bigotry—we need to focus on the facts, and the facts tell us loud and clear that making sure everyone on the road has a driver’s license makes us all safer.”

The legislation would allow undocumented immigrants to apply for a standard New York license. However, it would not allow those individuals to vote or apply for an “enhanced” or “real-ID” license required for air travel.

Mr. Thiele said that the legislation would boost the state economy by roughly $57 million annually, according to data from the Fiscal Policy Institute. In addition, county governments are expected to see $2.6 million in new sales tax and vehicle use fees every year.

East End police chiefs—including Steven Skrynecki of Southampton Town, Michael Sarlo of East Hampton Town and David Hegermiller of Riverhead—have agreed that the legislation would improve public safety. However, in April, they raised concerns that the bill’s aforementioned privacy provision prevented local law enforcement officials from accessing information to enforce traffic safety.

Further revisions to the legislation, made by the measure’s legislative sponsor, clarified the ambiguous language, according to Ms. Perez. She said that the revisions make it clear that local law enforcement will have the ability to access drivers’ basic information to enforce traffic laws and public safety.

On Friday, Chief Hegermiller said that the East End chiefs met last week to discuss the bill, noting that they were still reviewing the revisions. He had said that he expected the chiefs to vote on formally supporting the bill in the next week or so.

However, on Monday, he called it a “moot point,” as the legislation had already been signed by Mr. Cuomo.

He reiterated that the East End chiefs do, however, support the bill. He added that undocumented immigrants driving without a license is an East End-wide issue.

“Everyone who operates a vehicle in New York State should be licensed,” he said.

Ms. Perez added, “Ultimately, I have faith that our local law enforcement will see this as a blessing.”

However, State Senator Kenneth P. LaValle is not on the same page.

In a prepared statement on Monday, he said, “I was a member of a New York State Senate Task Force on Immigration, and I have studied this issue at great length. I remain steadfast in my position that granting driver’s licenses to undocumented immigrants is not good public policy, presents a clear threat to public safety, and sends a wrong message to the law-abiding people I represent.”

He did not immediately respond to requests for comment following the bill’s approval on Tuesday.

In a recent Facebook post, following the State Assembly’s approval of the bill, the Republican Assembly Campaign Committee called the legislation “an endorsement of the lawlessness on our country’s southern border and a back door to legal status.”

Ms. Perez, however, strongly disagreed with that perspective, calling the legislation “the best thing for our community.”

“This is life or death—this is the health of a child. This is all of those things,” she said. “The last thing it is is politics.”

She added that OLA intends to work with community members to help driver’s license applicants understand the written test, provide acceptable proof of residency, and ultimately pass the driving test.

The group’s executive director pointed to a number of benefits that she expects to come out of the approved legislation, including safer roads and an increase in annual revenue. But, perhaps more importantly, she said the legislation will help parents connect to local schools.

The lack of public transportation has been a roadblock for many local undocumented parents, who often can’t attend after-school activities, parent teacher conferences and board of education meetings, she said.

Additionally, local school districts have all recently implemented new security measures that require visitors to sign in and provide proof of identification, which Ms. Perez said deters many undocumented parents from becoming involved in the school community.

“We need our parents to be connected to our schools. Students do better—it’s good for everyone,” she said. “It behooves us to do everything we can to connect parents to the school processes and their child’s education.”

Speaking to those opposed to the legislation, Ms. Perez said, “They’re going to see by the lives that were bettered that this was the best decision to make for our entire East End.”

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This is a sad day for tax payers in NYS. Trouble ahead. The Governor wonders why people are leaving the state of NY. Fred Thiele is clueless and has no backbone for Americans.

Granting driver’s licenses to illegal "undocumented" immigrants is not good public policy, is a threat to public safety and sends a bad message law-abiding, tax paying people.

Illegals break the laws and cost the United States billions,

By Hamptonsway (94), Southampton on Jun 18, 19 8:51 AM
On the other hand its a tricky way to document the undocumented.
Jun 18, 19 9:04 AM appended by themarlinspike
Now ICE can work with the DMV info to detain & deport the worst of the worst. It should be very easy to match license names & addresses with warrant info.
By themarlinspike (481), Northern Hemisphere on Jun 18, 19 9:04 AM
Why take away the license of a drunk driver for breaking the law if you are going to give a driver's license to someone who has broken the law?
By even flow (943), East Hampton on Jun 21, 19 9:49 AM
Because drunk driving is a violation of NYS vehicle and traffic law and crossing the border illegally is not.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 9:53 AM
I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support the constitution of the United States, and the constitution of the state of New York, and that I will faithfully discharge the duties of the office of ______________________, according to the best of my ability.
By Po Boy (4904), Water Mill on Jun 23, 19 9:26 AM
Now just show me the "immigration violations" section of the U.S. or State constitution and your point is made!
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 23, 19 9:33 AM
It has a cascade effect, does it not? In other words, if the constitution outlines who does what, and law is therefor spelled out in US code and federal regulation, it stands to reason our state representatives thereby have a role in supporting those who carry out those duties and should not implementing entitlements that promote illegal activity.
By Po Boy (4904), Water Mill on Jun 24, 19 8:58 AM
No, I don't buy into your slippery slope argument.

The federal government and state government don't always agree: state's rights, Po.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 24, 19 9:34 AM
Of course they don't. But state government and the policy decision of state officials shouldn't nullify the role of the federal government either. That's the core of the oath they've taken to support the constitution of the United States.
By Po Boy (4904), Water Mill on Jun 24, 19 11:19 AM
What is the federal government's role in issuing driver licenses?

NYS isn't preventing the deportation of these folks, simply allowing them to obtain driver licenses until the federal government gets around to them.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 24, 19 11:45 AM
The Federal governments position is they have broken the law, are here illegally and should be deported. We just don’t enforce it. If you want them to get drivers licenses you need to change that law first.
By razza5350 (1910), East Hampton on Jun 28, 19 7:48 AM
Is that's actually their position, but even if it was I don't think the law has to be changed: The federal government enforces immigration law and the state government enforces vehicle and traffic law; They are two separate things.
Jun 28, 19 8:06 AM appended by Fore1gnBornHBgrown
"I don't think that's actually their position" wow, reminder to never comment before my morning coffee.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 28, 19 8:06 AM
Illegal is the correct term. Granting them documents doesn't change the fact that they have entered and remain here illegally. It's just another small step towards the goal of open borders. Our politicians will keep allowing illegal immigration and allowing the privileges of citizenship to those who comes here illegally until it we have de facto open borders and anyone who thinks we should have borders just gives up the fight. Way to go Cuomo.

I believe this makes Trump's reelection ...more
By HB90 (163), southampton on Jun 18, 19 9:29 AM
1 member liked this comment
...might as well let them vote, also.
Jun 18, 19 10:34 AM appended by loading...
that's what it's all about
By loading... (579), quiogue on Jun 18, 19 10:34 AM
That’s coming next along with free healthcare (if they aren’t getting it already)
By razza5350 (1910), East Hampton on Jun 28, 19 7:49 AM
and that's the Democrat Party's ultimate goal^^^
By bigfresh (4546), north sea on Jun 18, 19 4:09 PM
1 member liked this comment
Allowing them NYS drivers licenses will allow them to get car insurance plus NYS DMV registration and give other drivers financial compensation in case of an accident. And aids police work. Good luck being compensated after having an accident w/ an unlicensed driver.
By Non-Political (124), Hampton Bays on Jun 18, 19 4:34 PM
Car insurance runs with the vehicle, not the driver.

What you're saying is give them licenses because they will just break the law anyway. Which is what they did when they came in illegally or remained illegally. So, law breakers just do what they want and eventually politicians will bend the law to legitimize their behavior? Hell of a way to run a State.

Cuomo must go.
By HB90 (163), southampton on Jun 18, 19 6:55 PM
2 members liked this comment
The car doesn't insure itself. A driver has to sign up for coverage. That driver has to be insured.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 18, 19 9:36 PM
Drivers should be insured individually and be covered in any vehicle they are driving at the time. It is so corrupt that you have to have insurance on each individual car you own just a bunch of red tape that makes the gov. $
By Undocumented Democrat (2007), southampton on Jun 19, 19 1:35 PM
So if you are brought here as a minor - and grow up here having no idea that you are 'undocumented' what should you do when you're old enough to drive?
By adlkjd923ilifmac.aladfksdurwp (734), southampton on Jun 19, 19 3:02 PM
not quite, a beater pick up is worth a lot more than a Maserati and the different premiums paid on each reflects the risk to the insurer.
By bigfresh (4546), north sea on Jun 19, 19 3:02 PM
It's like giving guns to law breakers it makes no sense
By chief1 (2768), southampton on Jun 18, 19 7:00 PM
we already do that now so....next point
By BrianWilliams (87), on Jun 18, 19 8:58 PM
How so?
By Po Boy (4904), Water Mill on Jun 19, 19 10:47 AM
GOOD BY FRED THIELE.... Lost my families support on election day....
By knitter (1858), Southampton on Jun 18, 19 7:04 PM
The only bigotry shown is by Mr Thiele and his anti America, anti tax payer stance. For him it is about money and supporting illegals who break laws to cost taxpayers billions of dollars. Mr Thiele gave full endorsement of the lawlessness and supports socialist organizations such as OLA. Illegals are destroying our country and over running the east end. Illegals pay no income tax and take resources from Americans who pay for it.

This is about getting votes. You get what you wish for so ...more
By Hamptonsway (94), Southampton on Jun 18, 19 8:44 PM
1 member liked this comment
Will delinquent non-custodial U.S. Citizen parents get a reprieve?
By loading... (579), quiogue on Jun 18, 19 9:01 PM
All these freedom lovers must love getting stuck with a bill when uninsured drivers hit them? About time
By banned (189), Hampton Bays on Jun 18, 19 9:54 PM
1 member liked this comment
MAGA MEGA ORLANDO
TRUMP STAGES GREATEST SHOW YET
CNN Cuts Away from Speech After ' CNN Sux!' Chant...
FOUR MORE YEARS...
KICKOFF: FLORIDA...
President Trump will formally launch his re-election campaign Tuesday night at the Amway Center in Orlando. The president is expected to address thousands of supporters, some of whom have been camping outside the arena since early Monday morning!!!
Jun 19, 19 1:21 AM appended by 27dan
The MSM is the enemy of the people. So are YouTube and all the social media companies trying to silence us. We will not be silenced. Trump 2020
By 27dan (2774), Shinnecock Hills on Jun 19, 19 1:21 AM
You're the enemy of the people
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 19, 19 6:19 AM
Keep America Great!!
By Po Boy (4904), Water Mill on Jun 19, 19 10:50 AM
2 members liked this comment
Things more trusted than CNN and Democrats

- Breast milk from Bruce Jenner
- Having a drink with Bill Cosby
- Gas station sushi
- A Hate Crime reported by Jussie Smollett
- A Casey Anthony babysitting service
- A casting call from Harvey Weinstein
By Ditch Bum (860), Water Mill on Jun 19, 19 1:51 AM
1 member liked this comment
I seriously loved the stare down that Trump gave the press with all the people behind him. Powerful!
By Erin 27 E (1239), hampton bays on Jun 19, 19 10:46 AM
Republicans 89

Democrats 1

Why does anyone trust a Republican?
The score is relative to dominos...
By Mr. Z (11554), North Sea on Jun 19, 19 9:31 PM
Love the intro on MotherJones: "This comes via a 4th-grade friend, who got it from some guy on Facebook, who probably got it from Daily Kos, who got it from Wikipedia" CLASSIC.

Let's look at “presidential administrations.” From "some guy on quora"..."if you’re talking about federal politicians by administration, that isn’t even close. 13 federal employees were convicted under the Clinton administration alone (10 Democrats and 3 Republicans).

There were 9 ...more
By Po Boy (4904), Water Mill on Jun 20, 19 7:58 AM
So, don't trust anyone over thirty?
By Mr. Z (11554), North Sea on Jun 21, 19 1:58 AM
- A post by ditch bum 27 dan
There I helped you out
By Fred s (3020), Southampton on Jun 19, 19 5:10 AM
I went to get my enhanced license - because I won't be able to fly without that or a passport domestically - I had my birth certificate, my social security card, my VALID NY driver's license and a copy of my marriage license. I had bills and bank statements with my name. I was denied because the marriage license was a copy. And now, you don't even have to be citizen to get a license? I am all for open boarders - but his just annoys me to no end.
By Coopers123 (7), Southampton on Jun 19, 19 8:57 AM
1 member liked this comment
So don't get your enhanced license and use a passport instead.

These folks are getting the same "Not For Federal Purposes" license we all get if we don't want to upgrade to enhanced.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 19, 19 10:40 AM
Maybe you didn't see my little note that I am all for open boarders - but I don't think I should have been turned away because one document was a copy when all the others were valid and original. It just annoys me is all.
By Coopers123 (7), Southampton on Jun 19, 19 11:17 AM
Yes, I was also annoyed that the federal government doesn't recognize the standard New York license anymore and slapped a "Not For Federal Purposes" on mine, but that has nothing to do with granting undocumented immigrants New York licenses which also won't be recognized by the federal government.

P.S. Open borders is a terrible idea.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 19, 19 11:31 AM
This comment has been removed because it is a duplicate, off-topic or contains inappropriate content.
By bigfresh (4546), north sea on Jun 19, 19 12:46 PM
Open boarders is wrong.

Giving illegals the right to drivers license goes against the 911 Comish Report. NYSDMV has no method to check their documents so there is going to be a great deal of fraud. They may refuse you Coopers123, but illegals get a pass. Do you file your income taxes?
By Hamptonsway (94), Southampton on Jun 19, 19 8:47 PM
Maybe open boarders is the wrong term - I simply mean that I am all for legally coming into this country through work visas or proper channels.

@hamptonsway - yes? Of course I file taxes. I am an American Citizen.

Which is why this annoys me so much. I have proof my birth, my New York and Suffolk County residency, my marriage (hence the name change) and because of one small thing - the license being a copy - they turned me away and I had to get the standard license. Now I have ...more
By Coopers123 (7), Southampton on Jun 20, 19 7:59 AM
It's frustrating thinking you have all the documents you need only to find out, you don't. But yeah, the state has NO IDEA who they are issuing a license to when someone is illegal for the very reasons you experienced.

The NYS DMV site has a waterfall click and go feature for the situation you described. When it gets to "You must bring one of the following" for proof of identification, it states for "U.S. Birth Certificate issued by a state of local government" in the more info microscope, ...more
By Mr. Snerdley (397), Southampton on Jun 20, 19 8:41 AM
@Mr. Snerdley - not sure if you are agreeing with me or telling me I should have looked closer. :) I did go through the whole check list and had all the documents and honestly had no idea that the certificate wasn't the original - I have a copy and the original apparently which I only found out when I went home and checked. The original did have the raised seal from the state of Maine so...back I go.

And yes it is frustrating - and I am sure there is a reason for all this, safety and whatever ...more
By Coopers123 (7), Southampton on Jun 20, 19 1:14 PM
The standards for the documentation requirements of the enhanced license were established by the federal government; it is the duty of the State of New York workers to follow those standards to the letter.

Whining about how you were inconvenienced by not exercising sufficient care in producing those documents is futile. And also totally irrelevant to the subject of issuing driver's licenses to any particular group of individuals.
By VOS (1224), WHB on Jun 21, 19 4:01 AM
1 member liked this comment
Understood. My family immigrated legally and contributed. I feel strongly this is an American problem and we are at fault for the illegal issue. Do not hire them, if you do, you pay the fine or go to jail. Do not give anything away that a tax payer paid for.

This is why all NY tax payers have to run to the DMV to get the upgrades. Thank Fred Thiele and his friends for making you and million more over run the DMV to do this. The current NYS Driver license is not worth anything. But why ...more
By Hamptonsway (94), Southampton on Jun 21, 19 10:04 PM
"Maybe open boarders is the wrong term -"

It's certainly the wrong spelling
By johnj (1017), Westhampton on Jun 25, 19 8:53 AM
1 member liked this comment
BORDERS - Sorry for the Spelling Error - I can see how this totally messed your whole day up - so badly, in fact, that you had to comment on it. I hope you can sleep at night now.

@ VOS - your comment is almost to snippy to respond to, however, I will make this one comment. READ what other people write and then make an informed comment. You can't read - but if you had you would have seen that I didn't realize it was the wrong document. And that it does, in fact, matter to this article ...more
By Polandspring (96), Southampton on Jun 26, 19 2:30 PM
Don't criticize my reading ability at the same time your comprehension level led you to go to the DMV with improper credentials.

You can use all the upper case letters you desire but that doesn't change the message. All applicants must follow the document requirements precisely or they will be turned away. That includes those newly permitted to apply for drivers licenses. Your experience is irrelevant to the case at hand.
By VOS (1224), WHB on Jun 26, 19 3:08 PM
Trump Raises $24.8 Million on Day of 2020 Kickoff Rally

‘Enthusiasm Across the Country for This President Is Unmatched’

25,000 PACK AMWAY CENTER…

…CNN’S SELLERS: IF ELECTION WERE TODAY, TRUMP WOULD GET ANOTHER 4 YEARS…

Republic should volunteer to work the polls, ballot counting, and every aspect of the process (with hidden cameras) to expose fraud. The left is going to try and cheat like you've never seen before.
By 27dan (2774), Shinnecock Hills on Jun 19, 19 10:26 AM
No you’re not paranoid. Also, trump is steady at 39-40% approval rating. That’s tepid at best.
By Fred s (3020), Southampton on Jun 19, 19 10:49 AM

@ GOPChairwoman
Follow Follow @ GOPChairwoman

@ realDonaldTrump has raised a record breaking $24.8M in less than 24 hours for his re-election. The enthusiasm across the country for this President is unmatched and unlike anything we’ve ever seen!

# trump2020 # KeepAmericaGreat
By They call me (2756), southampton on Jun 19, 19 12:30 PM
1 member liked this comment
This Summer is going to be so much fun !
By They call me (2756), southampton on Jun 19, 19 12:32 PM
But more than enough to kick the snot out of any of the lunatics in he Democrat freak show of candidates
By bigfresh (4546), north sea on Jun 19, 19 12:49 PM
TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP !
By Undocumented Democrat (2007), southampton on Jun 19, 19 1:31 PM
Saying that they are ILLEGALS NOT UNDOCUMENTED gets red inked?
By bigfresh (4546), north sea on Jun 19, 19 3:04 PM
1 member liked this comment
What do we say? Absolutely a travesty. An oxymoron. Illegal. No problem. We’ll protect you, and not only that, make your life easier here. Wtf are we becoming in the last 15+ years? I read comments from johnj, foreignborn, fred s, and I can’t wrap my head around their way of thinking. Getting a drivers license takes training, whether in school, or outside of school, takes many hours, and costs at least $600 through the public school system. Oh, did we mention “illegal” immigrants. ...more
By Lets go mets (377), Southampton on Jun 19, 19 5:30 PM
1 member liked this comment
What do we say? Absolutely a travesty. An oxymoron. Illegal. No problem. We’ll protect you, and not only that, make your life easier here. Wtf are we becoming in the last 15+ years? I read comments from johnj, foreignborn, fred s, and I can’t wrap my head around their way of thinking. Getting a drivers license takes training, whether in school, or outside of school, takes many hours, and costs at least $600 through the public school system. Oh, did we mention “illegal” immigrants. ...more
By Lets go mets (377), Southampton on Jun 19, 19 5:30 PM
1 member liked this comment
Well, perhaps you weren't born into a place where the gangs would murder you for not joining. Or, not in a place where the United States destroyed burgeoning democracy because of McCarthyesque fear.

I love to plant all you spoiled brats in a womb in 1952 Guatemala, and then see how you ass***** change your tune.
By Mr. Z (11554), North Sea on Jun 19, 19 8:48 PM
Why stop at Guatemala? You forgot the 1.216 billion who suffer from political violence throughout the continent of Africa.

The more the merrier.
By Mr. Snerdley (397), Southampton on Jun 20, 19 8:53 AM
Get used to it, the alt left progressives are trying to control speech over the whole Internet. It will back fire on them as usual, people don't like to be treated like children and told what and when they can say things, on the contrary it enrages them and they will revolt one way or another against this 1st amendment abuse that seems to be running rampant at the moment.
By joe hampton (3395), The Hamptons on Jun 19, 19 5:42 PM
Thanks for using my name in the post. I never commented on the drivers license issues.my reply’s were to the off the wall trump posts.whats to wrap your head around? I don’t share the same beliefs as trump? That’s good, I think he’s a liar and a low moral loser.
By Fred s (3020), Southampton on Jun 19, 19 5:43 PM
....... and i don't share the same beliefs as you, but unlike you, i still support your right to have your beliefs heard whenever and wherever you feel the need to express those beliefs, despite the fact that it might hurt someones feelings
By Erin 27 E (1239), hampton bays on Jun 19, 19 5:47 PM
By Mr. Z (11554), North Sea on Jun 19, 19 9:26 PM
One correction, Erin: you have a constitutional right to free speech, not a constitutional right to be heard.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 5:16 AM
That’s good, equal then
By Fred s (3020), Southampton on Jun 19, 19 6:05 PM
I really don't see how "but unlike you" is any form of intercession, let alone not the least bit insulting. Cruel to be kind, but don't be a hinny.

P.S> That's rarer than a jackass...
By Mr. Z (11554), North Sea on Jun 19, 19 9:47 PM
And the gnashing of teeth goes as expected.
By Mr. Z (11554), North Sea on Jun 19, 19 8:46 PM
They will do their best to destroy him...it was pretty brave of Burgess Owens on reparations on Wednesday : ‘Every bad thing that’s happened to my race over the years’ goes ‘right back to the Democratic party' for starters, there's no such thing as "African American"! you are either African, OR American, sooner people get that straight in their vocabulary, the closer we can finally be rid of all the race baiting and race-crap!

Thank you, Mr. Owens, for standing up ...more
By Undocumented Democrat (2007), southampton on Jun 20, 19 2:08 AM
If there's no such thing as "African-American" then is there also no such thing as "Irish-American" or "Italian-American"?
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 20, 19 6:15 AM
There is such a thing as "Born In The USA", and you're not that either. Just Sayin'.
By themarlinspike (481), Northern Hemisphere on Jun 20, 19 4:43 PM
I don't think I ever said I was, but what does that have to do with my question?
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 5:15 AM
There is no such thing as "Irish/Italian/African/French/English/snowflakes-American" just Americans with heritage. The sooner we figure that out the better for all of us.

And referencing Mr.0 ass**** comment, if you are a physically capable individual to walk thousands of miles, you are physically capable to stay put, stand up and fight for your country. If you are not willing to do that for your country, why would I want you here in mine.
By Bayman3142 (248), Southampton on Jun 21, 19 8:14 AM
1 member liked this comment
That's what African-American means: a person with African heritage.

The reason country-specific monikers are less common among folks with African ancestry is because this little thing called the transatlantic slave trade stripped that individualized heritage and history from many, many families.

You only want citizens who are willing to die for the US? Oh well, that's a hard pass from me.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 8:44 AM
I could have bet on that.
By Bayman3142 (248), Southampton on Jun 21, 19 4:57 PM
1 member liked this comment
And I could've bet you'd know walking thousands of miles is easier than surviving cartel assassins, but here we are.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 6:20 PM
Again, not necessary. Standing up to evil takes courage, resolve, and a sacrificial love for ones nation. You've made your position crystal clear. You are a guest here.

Cartel "assassins"? Really? How about tatted up street punks. You have to be aware that we do have these "assassins" here in the states now. Not all that impressed. They come pouring in over the border feeding the cartel cash, which happens to be the real problem.

And back to the original AnythingBut-American, ...more
By Bayman3142 (248), Southampton on Jun 22, 19 9:27 AM
1 member liked this comment
You're not impressed until they're in the news, then suddenly it's a hostile invasion that requires a military response.

Anyway, being American doesn't mean I owe the U.S. my life if it demands it. Ironically, that'd be the opposite of freedom.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 22, 19 10:18 AM
Uh, yeah it does. Freedom demands sacrifice because it never is free. You may not feel that way, and you can run if it comes down to it, I could care less. You are not American if you feel any different. You are a sheep. Like I said, you are a guest here.

As far as "impressed", far from it. I've dealt with street punks in the South Bronx, Jamaica, and any other crap hole you can think of. FAR from impressive.
By Bayman3142 (248), Southampton on Jun 22, 19 5:53 PM
1 member liked this comment
My sacrifice is the money I contribute to fund our military. If America wants to conscript me against my will, that's the day I stop being an American. That's not freedom, it's slavery.

Until then I'll continue being an American, much to your dismay I'm sure!
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 23, 19 9:31 AM
You always sound like a communist, sworn enemies of the USA.
By themarlinspike (481), Northern Hemisphere on Jun 23, 19 9:40 AM
Ok, can you please elaborate?
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 23, 19 9:44 AM
Like I've said, you are a guest. You admittedly will pay for protection, but if that protection fails you will run. How nice to be able to pay money for others to sacrifice blood for you.
By Bayman3142 (248), Southampton on Jun 23, 19 7:06 PM
Yes, it's the privilege of being American!

If I wanted to live somewhere with compulsory military service, I would.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 23, 19 10:42 PM
Are you not registered in the Selective Service?
By FarOutEast (16), Southampton on Jun 24, 19 10:51 AM
Priviledge or cowardice, tomato or tomahto.
By Bayman3142 (248), Southampton on Jun 24, 19 3:27 PM
Sure, Bayman. I'll be a living coward over a brave dead man any day.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 24, 19 9:25 PM
This comment has been removed because it is a duplicate, off-topic or contains inappropriate content.
By Bayman3142 (248), Southampton on Jun 24, 19 11:30 PM
I'm happy right here, Bayman.

Don't like it? Not my problem!
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 25, 19 6:33 AM
We all know that this is wrong in many ways. Also one legal driver can have insurance for several vehicles. Illegals drive without licences now. They get a ticket and drive next day. Nothing happens to them!! Yes legal citizens obeying laws are mad.
By Win sky (53), Southampton on Jun 20, 19 10:38 AM
Luckily many NY counties are refusing to issue driver's licenses to illegals. Cuomo's reasoning that it will help them get to their jobs ignores federal law that prohibits them from being here and NY State law that prohibits employers from hiring illegals.
By even flow (943), East Hampton on Jun 20, 19 4:22 PM
Funny how Iran didn't shoot down the aircraft carrying pallets of cash from Hussein Obama!
By joe hampton (3395), The Hamptons on Jun 20, 19 9:49 PM
1 member liked this comment
Good point joe. Except it was Iran’s money. You know why it was cash? Oh yeah , trumps a genius.
By Fred s (3020), Southampton on Jun 20, 19 10:02 PM
Brilliant move by Trump once again. He knows damned well that downing that drone was not sanctioned by the true leaders of Iran and that it was a false flag to draw the United States into war in the hope that it would delay or distract attention from the swamp draining that will become evident soon. Prison for Democrat criminals. We should be doing a retaliatory strike on the traitor John Kerry who was recently in Iran colluding with other deep state traitors and puppets. He probably had more to ...more
By They call me (2756), southampton on Jun 21, 19 9:47 AM
1 member liked this comment
The Democrats are siding with America's enemies again. They can't help themselves. The TDS is too strong.
By Ditch Bum (860), Water Mill on Jun 21, 19 9:51 AM
Iran is run by the Mullahs who don't care about the people only spreading Islam and destroying Israel & America. There is a large group of Iranians who are sane and would love to see the cult disappear, In 2009 they bravely stood up in mass to protest their radical government, they begged Hussein Obama for support... he was silent and 3 days later Neda Agha-Soltan was dead on the street. The people are trapped under a regime that has all the power and guns. Only way they will ever be free is to ...more
By joe hampton (3395), The Hamptons on Jun 21, 19 10:02 AM
1 member liked this comment
Why does it seem like every republican is becoming a conspiracy theorist who believes every democrat and their mother are part of the deep state? Too much Breitbart?
By FarOutEast (16), Southampton on Jun 24, 19 10:56 AM
Their leader says so. Keep the lies coming, it’s like grass to the sheep.
By Fred s (3020), Southampton on Jun 24, 19 11:03 AM
Because none of the current admininistrations "policies" are based on reality, but rather fabricated lies used to create fear and command subservience.
By johnj (1017), Westhampton on Jun 24, 19 11:04 AM
Let’s all get together and pick a law that’s unpopular say parking tickets or speeding laws. Laws were put in place because of problems that occurred without them. Once you start not enforcing laws it’s the beginning of end of order. Not a racist or ultra right just a law abiding citizen so let’s not go down that path when you can’t defend a position.
By Dee1961 (11), East Quogue on Jun 21, 19 8:31 AM
Can you think of any time in American history where the laws were out of touch with reality and needed changing?

Segregation? Prohibition? Women's suffrage?
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 8:46 AM
Yet you are scared crap-less to fight for The USA, like you just said :

"You only want citizens who are willing to die for the US? Oh well, that's a hard pass from me.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (6648), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 8:44 AM"

The Majority opinion :
If you are not willing to do that for your country, why would I want you here in mine.
By Bayman3142 (198), Southampton on Jun 21, 19 8:14 AM
By themarlinspike (481), Northern Hemisphere on Jun 21, 19 9:15 AM
You're right, I do fear dying! That's what happens when you have way too much to live for.

If I wasn't I would've joined the military. Excellent pay-scale and benefits if you're good at taking orders!
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 9:46 AM
You weren't vetted, or admitted to this great Nation based on merit, and thus you take & never give back. You truly are a persona non grata.
By themarlinspike (481), Northern Hemisphere on Jun 21, 19 9:54 AM
You have no idea how I was vetted or admitted to this country, nor how much I have taken or given back.

I also have this nifty official document called a naturalization certificate that says I am VERY welcome, so you're wrong there too.

Did you get a subscription yet? Let's take this back up tomorrow!
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 9:59 AM
Yore correct why have no idea how you were admitted to this country, or if you ever were, so why don't you tell us your story so we have some more information instead of playing mystery games
By 27dan (2774), Shinnecock Hills on Jun 21, 19 10:19 AM
Two reasons:

1. I don't want to provide too much personally-identifiable information, and

2. It's fun to see people's assumptions reveal their prejudices.

For example, nobody here has assumed that I entered the U.S. with an investor visa, lol.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 10:30 AM
The circumstances of your entry to the US does not constitute PII.
Jun 21, 19 10:38 AM appended by Po Boy
In other words...you ain't that special.
By Po Boy (4904), Water Mill on Jun 21, 19 10:38 AM
2 members liked this comment
That's one view. Another is that every immigrant's story of how they came to be an American is innately personal.

I think that the more details I provide the more personally-identifiable it becomes, so I will err on the side of caution, TYVM.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 11:20 AM
"Two reasons:

1. I don't want to provide too much personally-identifiable information"

Did you ever consider that is the reason the themarlinspike and others here don't get a subscription . or do you not remember a little incident under the last administration where newspapers were publishing the addresses of registered gun owners.
By 27dan (2774), Shinnecock Hills on Jun 21, 19 11:56 AM
I don't think the personally-identifiable information I share with the Press to obtain a subscription is disseminated to the rest of you fine folks, but please correct me if I'm wrong.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 12:31 PM
So, you think by identifying Foreghanistan it makes you somehow personally identifiable?

Um, no.
By Po Boy (4904), Water Mill on Jun 21, 19 1:50 PM
1 member liked this comment
The funny thing is, you can't really know how personally identifiable it is unless you know the country.

After all, there many be thousands of people born in country X on the East End, but only a dozen from country Y.

Also, as I said above, it's more fun learning about you through your assumptions.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 1:56 PM
And you have none.
By Hamptonsway (94), Southampton on Jun 21, 19 9:45 PM
A driver's license is a privilege granted after demonstration that one has learned the laws and is capable of following them safely.

Granting this privilege to someone who, by definition, has broken the law, will make it hard to prosecute driving infractions. Following the law is no longer a pre-requisite for obtaining and keeping a driver's license.
By even flow (943), East Hampton on Jun 21, 19 9:44 AM
1 member liked this comment
The licensing procedure requires applicants to know NYS vehicle and traffic law.

Fyi, federal immigration violations are not part of NYS vehicle and traffic law.
Jun 21, 19 9:49 AM appended by Fore1gnBornHBgrown
Your comment is like saying "you jaywalk sometimes so you can never drive." Just stupid.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 9:49 AM
I disagree it is not stupid.

You cant give an id to a person that broke the law to be here!
By Ditch Bum (860), Water Mill on Jun 21, 19 9:53 AM
2 members liked this comment
Why not? Doesn't that person still have an identity? Why wouldn't we be able to document it?

More importantly, why wouldn't we WANT to document it if you knew they're here illegally?
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 10:02 AM
Sure the have an idendety but not an American one. The action of no action documents that they are illegal. so NO! and NO to them voting in American Elections!
Jun 21, 19 10:13 AM appended by joe hampton
Sure the have an identity but not an American one.
By joe hampton (3395), The Hamptons on Jun 21, 19 10:13 AM
1 member liked this comment
I don't think giving them licenses suddenly makes them American, do you?
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 10:31 AM
Which identity are we talking about? The one when they illegally entered or the one they've assumed here in the US after they illegally entered?
By Po Boy (4904), Water Mill on Jun 21, 19 10:35 AM
I would think most of the folks who pursue this license would use the former because if you're going to obtain a fraudulent identity why would you pick an undocumented one?

In either case that person is now known to the U.S. which is a win in my book, and apparently Marlin's also.
By Fore1gnBornHBgrown (7664), HAMPTON BAYS on Jun 21, 19 11:24 AM
@ They call me & joe hampton & 27dan

War with Iran was precisely the tragedy that the Iran nuclear deal was intended to prevent. When Trump's overarching stupidity led him to abrogate that agreement, the current outcome was predictable. Horribly, that same stupidity will probably lead him to attack Iran eventually (against the advice of every US career diplomat and every US military chief), resulting in a protracted bloodbath that will kill and maim tens of thousands of our young people ...more
By highhatsize (4149), East Quogue on Jun 21, 19 11:00 AM
right out of the MSM spin machine HH, a bit tardy though .
By bigfresh (4546), north sea on Jun 21, 19 5:53 PM
Listening to your anti American / Israeli stance for years, combined with a pro Muslim spin on just about everything that comes out of the big mouth over the years. I assume when you say " a protracted bloodbath that will kill and maim tens of thousands of OUR young people you surly must mean Iranian young people.
By Undocumented Democrat (2007), southampton on Jun 21, 19 6:55 PM
@ Undocumented Democrat

Your every post is an object lesson on the awful outcomes that can ensue when an alien is permitted to circumvent normal immigration screening and winds up living among us.

Nevertheless, thanks for bringing Israel into the discussion. "I" didn't mention it but it has obviously occurred to YOU (as it has to every human being with a functional cortex) that the ONLY winner in a US/Iran war is Israel. (As was true of the US/Iraq war.) Certainly Bibi has made ...more
By highhatsize (4149), East Quogue on Jun 22, 19 1:00 PM
So just what is you nationality background anyway HHS Iranian ? Palestinian maybe ?
By Undocumented Democrat (2007), southampton on Jun 23, 19 4:43 AM
@ Undocumented Democrat

I am an unalloyed American, Undocumented Democrat, with no fealty to any nation other than the one that I love and to which I owe everything. The idea of putting it our my fellow countrymen at risk by subordinating my country's interests to the agenda of a foreign power is abhorrent.

How about you?
By highhatsize (4149), East Quogue on Jun 23, 19 1:49 PM
clearly not the answer to the question that was asked
By Undocumented Democrat (2007), southampton on Jun 23, 19 5:05 PM
Sounds like Ruth Bader Ginsburg will be stepping down !
By 27dan (2774), Shinnecock Hills on Jun 24, 19 10:13 PM
Hot Tubs,SALE, Southampton Village, SouthamptonFest weekend